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The problem with Casino Coins will solve itself. As enough webmasters realize that they’re not making enough money to warrant the traffic they’re sending them, they’ll pull them from their site. That’s how the free market works.
Luckily we have a place to go to warn other webmasters when something isn’t exactly right with a program.
And as a group, we have some leverage with these programs to try to get them to make the changes that need to be made.
Luckily we have a place to go to warn other webmasters when something isn’t exactly right with a program.
Yes and thank you Prof for this forum to give us a place to go to compare notes.
Although this thread really took a bad turn the topic of chargeback and shaving have been spouted for yours. Let me give you my take on it.
1. I myself do not usually take a detailed look at my chargebacks unless there is a red flag. I look at my net payment from an aff program at the end of the month and if it does well and is consistant with the add space given to that aff program then I am happy.
2. If I see during the coarse of a month that the earnings drastically drop from a program then I will look more into it but people need to understand chargebacks like winners and fraud happent to the casinos and will always come back to us.
3. The fact that these items seem to come at a regular time like the end of the month or at conference time (although I have never really noticed that) I think that may have alot to do with how each aff program processes their credits and such. I recall have this discussion several years ago with several top affiliates and we shared that the chargebacks came near the last few days of the month.
4. I think the fact that we share information such as I got a large increase in chargebacks at the end of the month for xxx aff program is something to put in a public section as I want to know if others are also experiancing this. This is a way for us to see if there is a pattern. It is also a way for the aff manager to address it to all of us at once. Also hearing it from one source does not squeek as loud as a thread of experianced webmaster sharing information.
5. Saying that I think it is CRUCIAL that we do not include slander or attacks in this against anybody including Aff managers, programs and affiliates. The threads of shaving also do not belong in the public boards. If you don’t think you are doing well at an aff program than state I don’t do well at xxxx and quit promoting them. If lots of affiliates do the same then that will solve the problem.
Sorry for the long message but I get quite a bit of benefit from CAP and I enjoy participating. It also USUALLY is a nice break from doing all the other stuff we need to do to make money in this biz.
Lou I really hope this blows over and the CAP continues as I don’t know anybody in our industry who could run one of these boards as good as you.
Brian
Originally posted by islandmaan
The threads of shaving also do not belong in the public boards. If you don’t think you are doing well at an aff program than state I don’t do well at xxxx and quit promoting them. If lots of affiliates do the same then that will solve the problem.That is the worse thing we could do (not go public) – and quite frankly that is why these programs get away with doing what they do! If you are content with your profits and don’t do anything at all to curb the shaving – why would a program stop doing it?
Moreover if the big boys stay quite and keep everything behind closed doors – the programs have NO reason to change anything. Once the big boys decide to make a stand for what’s right (fairness and equality for all) then and only then will this industry grow stronger and better for affiliates as a whole.
The problem with that however is that most of the Big Boys could careless about the smaller affiliates and equality as long as they are getting theirs! They will NOT remove links if they lose $5000 off of $50000 !!!
Sure we don’t have any EXACT evidence that this chargeback issue is cheating, BUT we sure can add up the occurrences and the total dollars lost and see that something is going on here! WHY set back and let it continue?
Half a dozen of us here could add up all the chargebacks (numbers and totals) for EVERY program we promote and it’s not even close to Coins! I’m confident we are not a minority and that are in fact the majority – in that I would surmise the greater percentage of affiliates at Coins have excessive chargebacks!
WHAT are they doing or have they done to correct this problem? Its obvious its a major problem – why hasnt it been aggressively and successfully addressed?
Could it be because they dont want to fix it? Dont over think things here – KISS (keep it simple stupid) they have excessive chargebacks across the board – they havent fixed the problem which has been going on for years …
Sure we could ALL run around and post brown-nosing responses every opportunity we get. Always doing our best to try and look good, but if we dont stand up for our OWN opinions – we have failed ourselves.
It seems that we ALL have come to an agreement – something is seriously wrong with the Casino Coins chargebacks ….
What shall “we” do? What CAN “we” do?
CC has been the leader in chargebacks for years.
They also have a processor that only sums up the chargebacks once every 3 months.
Due to the flood of complaints this causes, I hear that they have started trickling some of the major ones so it’s not so overwhelming.
The casinos appear to have some problem – and I was also told by an independent person that yes, they are mostly Citadel chargebacks and have been for years. This agrees with Connie’s statements.
So the solution would seem to be to remove Citadel – but apparently they have known this for a long time and haven’t done so.
So you’ve got to assume that Citadel makes them a lot more money than it loses them.
The question is – how many Citadel deposits are you profiting from? Does it outweigh the aggravation of the chargebacks?
I think this is the question they need to be asked.
I don’t promote them at all so will not be pursuing this. Just my thoughts here.
Brian
Your mailbox is full.. LOL
I think i did not express myself clearly enough but I will keep it short. My point is not to be throwing around the words shaving without any proof.
I did say we should share our experiances of chargebacks or whatever deductions and the times these occur, thereby if there was any problem it would be evident to all, the aff managers and the affiliates.
The point is not to make accusations in a public forum without proof. If this is going on then the proof will be in the number of complaints.
One thing you also have to look at is how each program does their processing. If they are a little loose on their up front deposts then two things will happen, more money comes in the front door in depots and more money goes out the back in chargebacks.
If at the end of the month and long term you make more revenue then that is a winning situation in my opinion.
Brian
Well there are several points i would like to make.
Lou, a lot of us here have portals dedicated to affiliate marketing , and none of us have succeeded in having anything compared to this forum. I dont know how much money you make from this, but what I know is that in 2-3 years when internet gambling is even bigger, this forum will be worth even more, and you should therefore not quit on it.
It seems that a lot of your time is unfortunately devoted to maintaining this forum. To save yourself some time and grief, so that you can focus on your portals which probably earn you a lot more money, you should consider paying someone a monthly fee. That person could probably login every second day or so to monitor and address these posts. This would probably cost not that much, just a couple of hundred a month. The benefit is that it would free up your time so that you can focus on your other websites. I’m sure that your time is worth a lot more than what you would be paying. I know winneronline does this.
Secondly, I’m sure there are some legitimate reasons for the chargebacks at Casino Coins. I personally no longer promote them due to poor performance, but this is due to the software and not the integrity of the program. I’m sure one reason behind the chargebacks is that odds on casinos are a small group and dont have the huge network of casinos like microgaming and cryptologic that can share databases and information on fraudulent players. To speculate more on why this is happening to me would be foolish based on lack of information.
Concerning affiliate programs shaving during conferences I really cant see why they would choose this time of year over any other. The cost of travelling to these programs and dining some affiliates, is very minor compared to the profits these programs generate. I’m sure the cost is less than 5% of what they make that month (maximum!)
The only way to know if the casinos are being fraudulent is by testing them like some of the affiliates in this forum do. What I do is compare the clicks sent in a month compared to the profit made and I then know whether or not I am happy with the performance of a certain program. If I’m not happy I drop them. I have dropped referback and casinocoins because of this.
Antoine
Internet Gambling can only grow bigger and bigger … the internet
is a PERFECT medium for it.
:rolleyes:
Hey Lou,
Thank you my good friend for providing a place for all of us to meet. As far as the shaving issue, I believe we all should keep that in the private areas till there is concrete proof that shaving occurs.Hey Alan, can’t wait to have a beer with you and patti again. Off topic but we need to lighten up this topic anyways.
Brian
Hey Brian,
Looking forward to seeing you again my friend. :bigsmile::cheers:
Thanks for all the positive comments guys. I am taking a few days off then will be back as usual at CAP. I guess I have too many friends here to throw that all away.
:cheers:Professor, you have the best darn casino affiliate forum on the web!
Thank you for that.
Glad to hear you’ve reconsidered.
You do have tons of good freinds here, and we need you around, too!
We’ll try to behave more professional.
