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Please Contact Tex Ress Player Disputes @ Ecogra They are the ones who set out the procedures we need to follow and are an independent from Us or any other Casino Group The document was Drafted after we sent your Complaint Onto them for invetigations.
Address: eCOGRA Limited
2nd Floor
Berkeley Square House
Berkeley Square
London
W1J 6BD
United Kingdom
Tel:
Fax: +44 20 7887 1481
Email: info@ecogra.org
Company Registration Number: 4690117
VAT Registration Number: 830 8129 41
If the policy is to take someones money and not return it because they have any sort of problem maybee the US is correct with the UIGEA afterall?
In my opinion in a perfect world, you would not be allowed to open a casino account if you had a gambling problem, regretfully software isn’t that up to the second. If it were possible, you would not have been able to deposit, or wager and win. I feel the return of your deposit is fair under those circumstances. However, that is no excuse for unanswered emails and having to bring the problem forth to this forum.
I can also tell you that people with gambling addicitions at land based casinos, in my state, do not receive winnings. If you lived here, had a gambling problem your name gets put on a “do not allow” list. That list is run through all the casinos in the state. If you are not stopped at the door and not allowed in, security is not always present at the door to card all, and say you start playing and win, when the attendant comes to pay you and ask for your id, thats where you are stopped. You would also not receive the funds you put into the machine, nor the winnings, and you are ushered to the door. I know this as I worked in a recovery center and sent those letters out and took many calls to verify problem gamblers. That ofcourse does not stop one from leaving the state to play, but there are reins put on addicts locally.
QUOTE “I look at this situation as if I was on a gambling addict list in a land based casino, do you really think they would tell me to empty my pockets before I walked out the door? Hell no and that is exactly what is going on here” BONUSGEEK
“there will be holes in your reasoning ” BONUSGEEK
“A big difference indeed. With a a land based casino, I can walk up to the counter and cash out my chips and collect my winnings, while online gambling players put 100% trust in casinos to do the right thing and pay them when they win.” BONUSGEEK
“I can also tell you that people with gambling addicitions at land based casinos, in my state, do not receive winnings. If you lived here, had a gambling problem your name gets put on a “do not allow” list. That list is run through all the casinos in the state. If you are not stopped at the door and not allowed in, security is not always present at the door to card all, and say you start playing and win, when the attendant comes to pay you and ask for your id, thats where you are stopped. You would also not receive the funds you put into the machine, nor the winnings, and you are ushered to the door. I know this as I worked in a recovery center and sent those letters out and took many calls to verify problem gamblers. That ofcourse does not stop one from leaving the state to play, but there are reins put on addicts locally”Oh, by the way, on most machines here, anything over $100 cash out of a machine calls the attendant for a hand pay and id check.
@cagney12 147756 wrote:
I can also tell you that people with gambling addicitions at land based casinos, in my state, do not receive winnings.
So big deal, a few land based casinos have policies to steal from players too. Thats not right either and I would be surprised to see the big and trusted land based casinos carry this policy “aka one that carries the ecogra seal” and more likely the behavior of a rogue small racetrack slot joint that you see everywhere. Your $100 attendant payout tells me this. Anyway, thanks for the reply cagney, but to me thats thievery too since they are not going to open up the slot and give the money back to a player found out to have a gambling problem.
And allfreechips nailed it. Roadhouse has already made it clear that some strings and concessions were made to get me this deposit back, and if I was not an affiliate they would have successfully stolen the deposit too from a regular player in the same situation.
The majority of problem gamblers end up at a recovery center due to a legal action such as bum checks, forclosure etc, the law mandates what actions to take for a person who admittedly has a gambling problem. The actions to not pay wins to that list of people is not only enforced by the casino’s in the state, but the state itself won’t pay lottery wins etc to them, I am not aware if the state will reimburse ticket purchase costs, which is no different than any investment one makes into gambling. Call it theft or whatever you like, but when these problem gamblers enter into a recovery program or seek assistance for their problems, they are made aware of the actions that take place so they are not surprised and do not refer to it as theft.
On another note, if you admit you have a gambling problem, can you honestly tell me you would have stopped playing after depositing 1500 and playing 45 minutes and ending with a 4k balance? If so, I don’t think you have a problem..IMO
I agree, this shouldn’t have to be at this forum to get your deposit or anything else back. Is it customary procedure to return a deposit and or profit from it in this instance?
@cagney12 147788 wrote:
On another note, if you admit you have a gambling problem, can you honestly tell me you would have stopped playing after depositing 1500 and playing 45 minutes and ending with a 4k balance? If so, I don’t think you have a problem..IMO
Thats a fair question Cagney and its hard to tell you exactly what I would have done in that situation. I have managed to cash out some very big wins from microgaming casinos this year, and I certainly have the ability to not gamble if I want. If I was a degenerate I would not be driving a corvette, be buying a half million dollar house and have a pile of money in the bank, but instead I would be broke with nothing to my name. Unfortunately because I tried to be responsible and close my other microgaming account when I felt I was depositing too much a couple months ago and needed a break, Roadhouse reels feels this is their license to steal my balance when I took a genuine risk of losing my total deposit.
@cagney12 147788 wrote:
I agree, this shouldn’t have to be at this forum to get your deposit or anything else back. Is it customary procedure to return a deposit and or profit from it in this instance?
Thats a good question is one of the points I have been trying to make. The answer is it is not customary procedure to return even the deposit. The reality is if I did not bring this situation to the affiliate forum they would have stolen my deposit too, even Miles made this clear when he talked about the strings he had to pull to get just my deposit back. They just can’t have it both ways. They can close my account and block access, no problems, but when they try to steal my money I am not going to just rollover. Its a flawed policy and if Ecogra fosters this same policy that is flawed too.
Well it doesn’t appear to me that you have a gambling problem, maybe was getting carried away at some pointand closed 1 account? Big deal…where did microgaming get the idea you had a gambling problem and put you on a black list? If that was done, I don’t see it as Road House not following law, but the problem would stem from MGS? Sorry if I am asking to many questions however I need facts to make decisions.
….and, if your name is on some list, what do other micros do in this situation, are any we trust willing to come forward and answer?
@cagney12 147794 wrote:
Well it doesn’t appear to me that you have a gambling problem, maybe was getting carried away at some pointand closed 1 account? ….and, if your name is on some list, what do other micros do in this situation, are any we trust willing to come forward and answer?
I do think my gambling has been out of control at times and it was more than just entertainment for me. In the past I have been forthcoming with casinos I have asked to close my account because of this. It’s usually something like” Please lock account XXXXXXXXX as I feel I am losing too much money and need to take a break ect….” I actually have no problem at all with microgaming putting me on a list and I think its the responsible thing to do when there is question of a player having any kind of gambling problem whatsoever. But it would have been nice to have been notified, then I wouldn’t be in this silly situation. But I don’t think this gives any casino the right to keep my winning balance from me on money I genuinely risked. As a matter of fact I recall several players over the years saying that they requested their casino account be closed temporarily after a big score in fear of losing it back, and the casino has no problem doing this and paying the winnings accordingly even though the player has just admitted that they have a tendency to lose control.
Frankly I don’t know what other microgaming casinos would have done in this situation, but I can assure you I won’t put my self in it again, and it is a shame that when a casino has the opportunity to do the right thing, they instead take the other road and pull these stunts with players like me just because they can. And trust me, there were games being played by them which is why I had to bring Miles into the mix in the first place. I knew this would be somewhat embarrassing for me to bring to the forums, but I would be remised if I had not. All these reasons they have given do not hold water and have holes in them any way they slice it. But its a good lesson learned by me, and they certainly won’t ever get any players from me as an affiliate. And I have such a bad taste in my mouth with this situation that I will probably never make another deposit anywhere online which in the long run is good for me.
Thanks again for the responses, but it’s time for me to put this matter to bed. They can keep the money, I hope they use it towards buying a little class, because everything reason and justification they have given holds no water and they have contradicted themselves umpteen times in this matter.
Sorry to hear of your problem BG.
reading the whole thread… I am torn to my loyalty towards you and points Cagney made which i was unaware of until now.
Considering your income and what seems to me a responsible approach to your gambling …. i’m not so sure you have a problem.
I think you took a very pro-active approach to not having a problem.
Perhaps MGS needs to re-think their approach to listing problem gamblers?
It would seem to me there is a difference between asking for one account at one casino to be locked and asking to be locked out of all casinos.
just my opinion.
I know I’d be pissed too if in your shoes. problem or not.
A player requesting closing an account temporarily and closing an account due to a gambling problem may make a difference, key word being temporary. If Ecogra states that Road House handled the situation correctly, then I don’t see a problem with them. I would say the problem began at the last micro you closed, they reported you as a problem gambler, which in turn put you on that list.
Perhaps microgaming, or any online casino needs to state what happens when a gambler says they have a problem and all online casinos need to follow the same rules, just as land based in my state. Players would atleast know what to expect.
Bonusgeek, thank you for sharing so much and please don’t be embarrassed, problems in life are just signs that we are alive. Nobody is here to judge you, we are judging how Road House Reels resolves issues.
One last food for thought, if you had an alcohol problem, had a previous DUI or 2, fell off the wagon and on the way home from the night at the pub, the cops pull you over. Do the cops give you a break for having a repeat offense? No…they give you a stiffer fine, jail time and longer with no license to drive. Does the pub you spent the evening at give you back the funds you spent on beverages?
I think Road House Reels was fair to give you your deposit back,that is the amount you risked, to bad it took so much work to get that.
When this is all done id really like you to do a test , open a new account at a microgaming casinos and go lose $100 , Then see if you can get it back .
good point 27.
I think there really should be an auto lock on accounts on any same address that has been listed as problem and it should be shut down auto …. before any money is allowed spent.
This was obviously not the case in BG’s situation and that allows all the other questions merit.
would the money …… had it been lost ……. been refunded?
if not …… then the money won ….. is owed.
It is true. this is not land-based. There are certain advatages to online gambling and one of them is there should be simple and automatic shut down of an account which shows same address or email addy. Much quicker than a land based casino could handle these matters.
Wow that was a lot of reading… I should have read what I need to do to get my site back to being listed and making money again.. IM POOR! lol
Anyway, from what I see there is a problem in the system. Its a bit dirty… There is a lot I would want to say about all that I have read but bottom line
“If we have already allowed a player that has gambling issues to purchase, wager
and cash_in and pay his cash_in, that mean s we have done a full set of
transactions with this player.That mean s basically we are encouraging him to play and do it again and again
or encouraging him to Gamble going against the responsible gaming laws and
allowing an addicted gambler to Gamble that’s like allowing a heroine addict to inject
himself over and over again in a Rehab centre when you know full and well he is addictedBut because we abide by the law and we are an honest casino, we told him we
are sorry, we don’t want to accept your business right now because of your
addiction but will give you back your purchase, and we would like to see you
again after 6 months when you have sorted out your issues. and that’s exactly” <--- this here is total bullshit Also, if the system cant catch someone before they make a deposit then the system does not help out the problem. It is a problem.. A BIG PROBLEM! Also I need to say something about the Heroine comment. First of all Heroine addiction is nothing like addictive gambling (you dont wake up everyday with the feeling of the flew that will only go away if you gamble)… 2. A heroine addict would never be allowed to walk into somewhere, buy a needle… and even if he was (lets say the drug dealer was looking out for his customers interest) They would NOT take his money… give him the needle, let him get high and so on… There is no way you can even really consider Heroine in this situation.. you dont get more heroine from doing heroine… and if you did.. well then I would have to say it would belong to the person getting high making it… and in this case its the player as he was getting high and winning more heroine.. if you catch my drift…. I am glad you got your deposit.. your lucky on that one. The way the system is setup is clearly made to screw the player.
