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Affiliate Guard Dog already works very hard to do just that, there is a forum area here at CAP that is updated often of changes
As a person who believes in true capitalism to even mention the word “union” sends me running. I do believe however that as affiliates and the backbone of the online gambling industry we should all work together to create a ” set of standards” that all members would agree to abide by. I have noticed that some of these online gaming establishments have depended on their affiliates to provide advertising over the years, only to change the rules once they aren’t needed anymore. This has got to be something that should be challenged as a group.
Just my 2cents worth.
@deborah61 157988 wrote:
…I have noticed that some of these online gaming establishments have depended on their affiliates to provide advertising over the years, only to change the rules once they aren’t needed anymore. This has got to be something that should be challenged as a group.
This was the reason AGD was created. We have challenged many affiliate programs since we began operations. We challenge them initially when we review their Terms and Conditions (and have gotten quite a few changes) AND we challenge them when a NEW terms change has been enacted (gotten many reversed).
This is what we do and we do it for the affiliates. It is not a union, nor will it ever be. Just a website which aids affiliates in being treated fairly. The more affiliates support us, the stronger we become.
We have aff guard dog to take care of T&Cs, and we have CAP to mediate, and we have asp already – what else do we need? We have APCW to audit… I think over the years we have developed a pretty nice support system.
All of these things are not that easy to implement, and Professor and KW and JTodd have developed these systems for years.
Makes no sense to start over when we have things that work very well indeed.
But is it truely working? Bookmaker is messing with some affiliates, Bodog has cease to pay, countless other programs are starting to be flaky. Maybe its time to start a Union and start bringing down banners of the more questionable associates who go their own way.
@kwblue 157990 wrote:
This was the reason AGD was created. We have challenged many affiliate programs since we began operations. We challenge them initially when we review their Terms and Conditions (and have gotten quite a few changes) AND we challenge them when a NEW terms change has been enacted (gotten many reversed).
This is what we do and we do it for the affiliates. It is not a union, nor will it ever be. Just a website which aids affiliates in being treated fairly. The more affiliates support us, the stronger we become.
I don’t mean to be naive, I haven’t been a member really of any webmaster forum, affiliate group, etc, but what is AGD? We as a network have not really had much of a problem with the majority of programs we advertise but after years at it we have only targeted the ones who have been successful both with conversion rates, customer service and prompt payments.
There have been a few disappointments over the last year with some programs changing their TOS, my thoughts are just not to bother to continue to promote them.
Anyway just wondering what this AGD is?
Deborah
AGD is Affiliate Guard Dog — http://www.affiliateguarddog.com
Of course it is working, like Dom said there are several sites that branch off and do something in their own each way to help support all affiliates in the biz. CAP has all the certified programs here and if ever you have an issue you can go right to the affiliate manager via a pm or post to them they all have their own thread here just for that. I have always had good results when I pm one of the managers with any concerns I have.
APCW works very hard to bring us the very latest in industry news and Integrity really puts himself out there in these crazy times just to keep us informed and they also audit programs to make sure everything is tracked and running accurate. They have a spot here on CAP where you can catch up on all the action in the biz:)
AGD what can I say I am a bit biased with this site..lol Kwblue has really worked hard to get this site working and it isn’t easy to keep up with all the changes in terms believe me but the site is designed to notify the busy affiliate who don’t have time to sit and read all the terms and conditions of each and every program so we do it for you. If a program changes terms and adds predatory terms your notified here on CAP.
@john1124 158006 wrote:
But is it truely working? Bookmaker is messing with some affiliates, Bodog has cease to pay, countless other programs are starting to be flaky. Maybe its time to start a Union and start bringing down banners of the more questionable associates who go their own way.
Bodog has paid us a high $xx,xxx COMMISSION this week so i disagree that they dont pay.Jordan told me the lady who does payments quit about 2 weeks ago unexpectedly and they have alot of new people there so i think they are just trying to adapt to some internal changes.
CAP is great for discussion
AGD is great for analysis
APCW great for audits
GPWA is another great resourcebut none of these systems is a Union or anything remotely similar, so I disagree. a Union is what gives these tools teeth. it would not be re-inventing the wheel – what it would be is the sharpening of teeth.
Blacklisting sites or rouge lists are a crude form of unionizing. The only difference would be to have an organization that could speak on behalf of your blacklists / rouge lists as one unified voice. Often I’ve seen this quote thrown around here
“Maybe it’s time to blacklist them, who’s in?”
Have you said this before? If you have, you are basically trying to unionize. And I have seen this be very effective.
A union is just a unified voice saying this same thing, at the same time, preferably with some frightening numbers behind us. Why would a casino submit to a union? Because another casino can open that is perfectly willing to play a straight hand, and that scares the shit out of them. They submit because if a good group comes in, they are out of business immediately.
I for one would support such an idea, however I would not think it would be an easy task. I’d even donate resources.
Feel free to disagree with me, but please be civil with me :]
It would not just be casinos that “submit” to a union, it would be us.
I have always been self employed, and I do not like being told what to do.
I actively – and voluntarily – support CAP and AGD and APCW, and GPWA too. I am perfectly willing to put time and energy and even funds into these endeavors.
I also am in favor of VOLUNTARY blacklisting and have been openly involved in several of these. All of them successful I might say.
Affiliates are a unique breed, they are a bunch of smart, independent, innovative entrepreneurs with their own opinions and the freedom to make their own decisions.
It certainly would not be worth it to me to give up my individual freedom of decision, especially since all the information to base intelligent decisions on is already made publicly available by the above organizations.
IMO we need information to base our decisions on, not some organization telling us who we can and cannot promote.
Additionally, I listen to players more than to affiliates when I decide what goes on my site. And that is going to stay that way.
Dito Dom :hattip:
I like it completely up to me who I promote. I don’t need Someone telling me who to or not to.
Everything is covered in what we have already established as entrepreneurs in this field.
BradHi all,
Sorry to burst any bubbles but frankly … and I very much include myself in the mix when I say … we can’t seem to even get along well enough to trade thoughts in a civil manner via by sharing the same site / space (in ref to all the dramas etc that have went on over the years).
What on earth eludes to the possibility of this bunch of head-strong self-leaders ever being able to come together far enough to establish a working union?
…sigh. And I wish it wasn’t so. The old-timers know I have harped since almost my beginning that we all need to at least get along well enough to be able to come together when needed – to accomplish common goals or defeat common enemies.
And happily I can say that almost every time we’ve needed to make something happen we have managed to stumble and grumble our way down the common path … but I don’t think its ever been a smooth operation by any stretch of imagination.
What effects change in any kind of timely fashion with some of the more stubborn programs if not most of them … is when we can as a majority take an action that the programs can feel in as near as a real-time reaction period as possible. Meaning if a large majority of us were to pull links at or near the same time then the programs sees a tangible drop in traffic … they then … and only then … (as time has proven) will change their minds and not impliment the new predatory terms or whatever.
Since it takes a little time for word to spread amongst us there have been times when we were fighting an issue that it didn’t look like we were going to win at first but as momentum gained with the word spreading… and the blacklists grew … a more aff-friendly attitude was adopted. Or rather I should say … “kept” because most times we were fighting just to keep the programs to honor their original agreements.
So we need a really good means of communication amongst ourselves which is basically accomplished thru sites like this one … affs seem to have found themselves in several groups rather than one large one which may slow our reaction time but still should make it possible to accomplish the communication factor.
Communication and cooperation … are two areas in which one can never be too rich.
@bb1webs 158213 wrote:
Since it takes a little time for word to spread amongst us there have been times when we were fighting an issue that it didn’t look like we were going to win at first but as momentum gained with the word spreading… and the blacklists grew … a more aff-friendly attitude was adopted. Or rather I should say … “kept” because most times we were fighting just to keep the programs to honor their original agreements.
So we need a really good means of communication amongst ourselves which is basically accomplished thru sites like this one … affs seem to have found themselves in several groups rather than one large one which may slow our reaction time but still should make it possible to accomplish the communication factor.
Communication and cooperation … are two areas in which one can never be too rich.
Steve This is exactly what I wanted to say in my post above you are just so much better at it:hattip:
Dito
Brad@Tarzan 158195 wrote:
Blacklisting sites or rouge lists are a crude form of unionizing. The only difference would be to have an organization that could speak on behalf of your blacklists / rouge lists as one unified voice.
…
A union is just a unified voice saying this same thing, at the same time, preferably with some frightening numbers behind us.
…
Feel free to disagree with me, but please be civil with me
As has been mentioned above by experienced affiliates – the problem with a “union” structure is that you will have many, many members who will simply refuse to be led in any direction that they don’t want to go.
Unless you got my support for a particular “black-list” proposal or course of action then I won’t support or endorse it at all … in fact it would led to my resignation.
A case in point may be the recent thread on Moneybookers.com, where I see some members are having troubles, but frankly they are the best e-wallet out there in my opinion (especially for European / Southern Hemisphere operators) and I would not put my name to any “action” against them.
Another example may be the tacit approval that 888.con / Cpays and Europartners have on many major affiliate portals simply because they have deep pockets to pay for sponsorships and certifications. I have no time for any of these players and would not put my name to any “endorsement” of them.
I’m sure that all experienced affiliates have similar/different reactions to similar/different groups based on their own personal experiences.
– You are trying to create a “unified voice” where there is none.
– You are trying to create a democratic “majority rules” organisation out of people who prefer to think and act for themselves.
The reason why successful affiliate forums like CAP, PAP, GPWA, APCW exist is because they’ve stood the test of time. Successful affiliates are business men and women who do like to come together and share and read posts and then determine the truth and any course of action for themselves.
The only union I’d be prepared to join is one that was willing to make me a life time dictator – that way I’d be sure to agree with every decision. But I don’t think that’d be very popular …
:tongue:
