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Hey Guys
I have brought this issue up in the past but as I was reviewing stats for a new program I signed up with it only refueled my feelings on this because I feel like I’m getting gipped for alot of money that should be mine and not all the casinos.
When on a standard commission plan at alot of RTG and casinos using their own software it appears that if the casino offers a no deposit chip from the casinos side in regards to statistics they view it as a deposit made, whereas when it’s calculated into our commissions and the way we see it, it’s viewed as a bonus. Meaning we have to subtract the full amount of the bonus from our commission and the casino doesnt.
To make this more easier to understand…
Say I sign up at Shark casino with a coupon for $20 no deposit. According to the rules (I’m making this up as I go) I can cashout a maximum of $60. So I go ahead and signup.
The casino reports on that affiliates statistics as.
1 new player
0 in deposits
$20 in bonusesso I stand at -$8
I lose. The casino gains a player and more then likely lose nothing monetarily.
Now…say over that month I get 100 people to sign up and take that chip. Now i’m looking as an affiliate at -$700 in bonuses or so making my total amoun t earned in the red by 700. SO as an affiliate i’m WAY in the hole though the casino (assuming noone cashed in) lost nothing in fact only gained 100 players. Let’s say two of my players signed up each deposit $100 for a total of $200. My cut should of been $70 for my commissions but since 98 other people used the bonus even if they dont cash in anything I have a -$700 balance……So the casino gets every dollar of the deposit to keep, all the players, I get nothing. No comission and a fat hole to climb out of.
If the casinos are going to use this unbalanced scale to figure totals for affiliates then I think that it would only be fair if those bonuses, rather then being docked from our end 100% be looked at as a deposit made, since,hyptothetically a player can cashout (in this case $60 maximum). This way anytime a player deposits cash we actually aren’t so far in the hole we stand no chance at any money. Then this way the casino has to take a hit the same amount as we do, I mean they do it that way for everything else….
Hopefully I have made sense lol and if not I can try to reexplain but IM pretty frustrated at my stats for three RTG casinos who are making money and losing nothing and I on the other hand am only watching them make money off my hard work!
Matt
that’s why I never give any RTG prime spots on my sites. And for that matter, I hardly list any of them because they don’t have a healthy bottom line.
they can cut the pie in as many shapes or pieces as they want, but at the end of the day if my plate didn’t get what I think is a fair-share, those casinos go to the back of the line or completely off my sites.
RTGs just don’t make any money in comparison to microgaming.
Well put and I agree….
but bottom line they are ripping affiliates off and it’s not right! I of course learned the hard way. I was on the phone once with an affiliate manager way back when I started and had sent alot of traffic and obtained alot of players, and I explained this same concern back then and the manager said “Yeah I hear you I totally agree with you, but that’s just the way RTG is, but we can’t do anything about it”….
But then Programs like Ad Riches come along and totally take care of their affiliates so why lie…….
Matt, you are wrong here.
They put the $10 in the bonus but once the player lost that bonus you will also have $10 in net-win, so your net profit is $0
I tell you where the problem lies…
Many players open mutliply accounts to recieve the no-deposit bonus again, those accounts are being closed by the casino but they dont remove the $10 from our stats.
That’s what I think is happening…I’m amazed by my connect2casino total stats:
Number of Clickthroughs: 8145
Number of Downloaders: 8766
Number of Players: 8510
Number of New Depositors: 218
Total Initial Deposits: $12,585.00
Total Deposits: $88,275.00
Net Win: $727,369.99
Coupon Amounts Awarded: $523,123.70
Manager Credit Amounts Awarded: $195,312.93
ChargeBacks: ($1,575.00)Net Profit: (Net Win – Coupons – Credits – Chargebacks) $715.63
Amount Deducted: $4,473.21
Amount Miscellaneous Adjustments: $0.00
Amount Added For Reversed Bans: $3,179.33
Amount Earned From Tiers: $0.00
Amount Earned: ($578.24)You see there are more players then clickthroughs which means that players open multiply accounts.
Thats explaining how $88,275.00 in deposits get me -$578.24Yes Matt, this is not correct. The bonus shows in net win but it has nothing to do with the net profit from which your commissions are calculated.
It seems like I need to correct this perception of RTG stats on a monthly basis. I wonder if there is something we can do here to make this more clear. I would be open to suggestions.
ThanksJeff, what about the problem of multiply accounts?
Glad you mentioned that. RTG has just implemented a new system that allows the casinos to set more strict guidelines for giving away bonus money. This just came out this month, and it will allow us to catch this before it happens. I’ll dig up some more info on the system and I can email it to you.
ThanksWell regardless of the calculations this only of course singles out casinos that are bonus happy like Connect, Shark, Portofino, Inetbet etc. Those are the ones I feel like are ripping me off since if I had $2,000 in deposits at most other casinos I would be seeing like 800where as with them I havent seen a flippin penny and they have 900 players from me!
I just got done playing at inetbet. I was testing it.
I deposited $100, played it up to $250, withdrew $100. Then I played another week with the rest of the money until it was gone. At no time did I get a bonus.
I didn’t ask for one either – I don’t like bonuses. I don’t want to worry about wagering requirements.
INetbet isnt so bad except they do those vote bonus promos for gambling.com with the forums and they have alot of coupons throughout the month. I will say they are hardly anything of a bonus happy casino compared to connect, and shark.
geez Playsafe, those numbers are slap in the face unless your traffic is just not that kind to produce a lot of income.
You would know that stuff better than any of us, but if those numbers came from my traffic I’d be screaming bloody murder.
218 depositing players and you’ve made – $500 ?
that’s outrageous!
haha you think that’s bad…
Check this out:
I only actively promoted them when I was still new and for only loike 5 months. I have not even considered promoting them for about the last 6 months. So this is about ayears total now and I have not seen ONE penny from them and they claim no negative balance will carry over after you send them like 80 players or something but that’s a bunch of crap……I email them all the time they dont respond grr!
Visitors: 855
Downloads: 740
Signups: 760
Depositors: 14
Total Deposits: $1,964.00
Net Win: $11,896.62
Bonuses: $15,249.04
Credits: $336.39
ChargeBacks: $0.00
Net Profit: ($4,459.98)
25%-35% C ommission: ($1,115.00)
2-Tier: $0.00And my traffic is pretty decent considering how short I have been doing this for and the amounts I am pulling in after a years work.
Originally posted by Chips For Free
haha you think that’s bad…Check this out:
I only actively promoted them when I was still new and for only loike 5 months. I have not even considered promoting them for about the last 6 months. So this is about ayears total now and I have not seen ONE penny from them and they claim no negative balance will carry over after you send them like 80 players or something but that’s a bunch of crap……I email them all the time they dont respond grr!
Visitors: 855
Downloads: 740
Signups: 760
Depositors: 14
Total Deposits: $1,964.00
Net Win: $11,896.62
Bonuses: $15,249.04
Credits: $336.39
ChargeBacks: $0.00
Net Profit: ($4,459.98)
25%-35% C ommission: ($1,115.00)
2-Tier: $0.00And my traffic is pretty decent considering how short I have been doing this for and the amounts I am pulling in after a years work.
My God those numbers are bad!
I think that if you are not getting at least $500 in net profit to casino I think it is ridiculous. Now I have not made so much players, but if I dont like what I see I kick them out in a flash – I might be a bit too hasty, but better hasty than sorry – I learned that the hard way (BTD).
In all I am a bit baffled when seeing so much of these one deposit wonders that I dont know what to think. I personally feel that players should stay and play weekly for months even years, at least as that is what I´ve done.
I know I will be able to produce a lot better player value than mere few bucks with my own casino that is opening soon and I am currently enjoying over $600 player net worth to casino with my basic privatelabel http://www.casinoroyalty.com So when concidering that I can make over $600 to casino with my tiny privatelabel how can any honest quality casino be making a few bucks per player – this goes way beyond my comprehension
I’m kind of still new in that I don’t have much traffic but what I am seeing of it is that something is happening with downloads/real player ratio. Getting a great clickthrough/download ratio but few signups and little or no real players. So I did a search ( http://www.casinoaffiliateprograms.com/bb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1295&highlight=downloads+depositing+players )on this site last nite and dug up an old thread about this topic, and it seemed like the major problems were:
1-bonus hunters
2-the signup process at a casino/bankingIf anyone can suggest off the top of their head online casinos/poker etc. that do not push the bonuses and have ease of use for the 1st time player it would be much appreciated. I’m getting a little irritated with having to go out and test every site. It is time consuming when those efforts should be geared toward improving my own site or marketing it. I’d much rather see fewer downloads and a few real players than all of these gaudy stats for the categories that, in the end, do not pay a dime.
As an example, at least one casino makes the new player go through two downloads to get to their games. The first one is small, but really unneccessary in that they ask the player to give their email, download their casino icon on their desktop, then use that to download the casino software. A lot of people are still on dialup and for a new player to come to a page and see they are going to be immediately hit with two downloads, plus giving their email up front (so they can be spammed to death if they decide not to play there-in their minds) cannot be attractive to them. If it was up to me, and it is not, I would have a landing page with:
free play on one side-which would lead directly to a game page, which would be a download software link. Let the free player play, without any hassles other than the download. If they never play for money, what does it cost the casino other than some bandwidth? If they decide to play for real money they will remember how easy it was to start playing and be back. And I really believe this is an issue for players (ease of use) and with there being hundreds of possible online gambling options available any little edge helps. Imo, whatever casino can accomplish this-making the playing of their games not an ordeal/same with the banking, will have a huge edge on the competition. They can have all of the fancy graphics or ridiculous bonuses they want but if the player hits what they perceive to be a wall trying to play the games, they won’t be back.
real money play on the other side, which leads directly to an easy to understand banking page. These players know what they want, a direct path to games for real money. Why is this so difficult? Why not create a form asking which of the following payment options they already have access to-Neteller, Firepay, Credit Card? Depending on which one, or none, send them to the respective relevant page with easy 1-2-3 type instructions. And quit giving people the impression they can use their credit card in a direct way. Most people think when they see the Visa/Mastercard logo they can just type in their numbers and start playing, which is not the case.
A new potential player/payer does not want to read/sift through all of the possible options. They are confusing enough one at a time, but these huge banking landing pages have got to be a turnoff to people. You might as well hit all of these players over the head with a sign that reads – “this is really illegal, which is why you are sitting here reading instead of playing casino games-you might as well go out to the Pogo site and avoid all of the hassle” When people go to a site to play these games they are excited and don’t wish to have to go through a series of disappointments to get where they want to go. It is suppose to be fun for them. So would someone out there please make the not so fun parts as painless as possible?
Oh, and maybe a section just for the bonus hunters. It is getting to the point where I am thinking about not having one banner/text link that promotes these things on my site.
Sorry for getting this off topic, but I feel better now. And to the thread starter, if it was me and I sent that much traffic- the bottom line is the bottom line. If you don’t make money with them, you move on. There is always another one to try.
Believe me I stopped doing anything involving my concentration for that casino a LONG time ago. It just still accrues with time and I think it’s hilarious!
Your best bet is MICROGAMING casinos if you want the most out of your players. I make a killing with referspot, casino profit share, and starting to do really well with casino rewards. Referspot is an excellent program in my opinon!!
