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  1. #1
    Senior Member pjotter's Avatar
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    help Warning: Is withholding my rightfully owed commission really necessary, Bet365?

    I thought Bet365 was a reputable program, but after what I have learned today I would suggest people to look for other programs if they can avoid Bet365.

    In my opinion they do not offer anything special, and from what I have learned they will only go that extra mile when it comes to withholding your rightfully owed commissions.

    Some big affiliates will probably disagree, but I hope everyone can see this from a small affiliate’s point of view - and that this is not ok.

    Well, he is my story:

    I am owed a mere commission amount of just $120 as of December 2012 and I have finally honored their affiliate-unfriendly minimum quota of five players, also in December 2012. So having honored this quota, I was thinking this month, January 2013, I was finally going to get paid for my efforts to promote them.

    Apart from the minimum quota, they also have a cumbersome requirement for payment where you have to generate invoices, print these, sign them and fax/email these to get paid. So I sent the invoice 08 January 2013. Nothing happens until 10 days later, today, where XXXX, my sudden affiliate manager from Bet365, contacts me via email. I don’t recall having ever received a personal email or a call from them, even though I have probably been affiliated with them for more than 5 years (It a good thing for them that they don’t have a minimum affiliate manager activity quota). After telling me that he is now my dedicated affiliate manager, this message follows:

    "As part of the programmes terms and conditions, we do require that an affiliate is actively promoting us in order to be able to withdraw their funds.

    I can’t seem to find where bet365 are being promoted on your site Casino Bonus News.

    Could you please provide me with a link to where you are promoting us?"

    I can’t believe what I am reading, but I do check the terms to find this:

    "6. Continued Promotion
    You shall incorporate and prominently and continually display the most up-to-date links provided by us on all pages of your website in a manner and location agreed by us and you shall not alter the form, location or operation of the links without our prior written consent. You are eligible for Referral Commissions based upon your continued promotion of Sports at bet365, Casino at bet365, Poker at bet365, Games at bet365 or Bingo at bet365. We reserve the right to reduce Referral Commission percentages if you reduce your efforts to recruit new Customers. Your reduced or suspended promotion of our sites will be deemed to represent your termination of this Agreement."

    I guess this is the clause he refers to as new reason for refusing payment, but I haven't received a reply yet to my question: are you serious?!

    I have links on Casino Bonus News to Bet365 as I have on other of my web sites. Last month I generated 42 click-throughs, 2 new players and 1 depositing player. Fair enough, so this month I only generated 4 click-troughs according to their stats, but my wife is just about to give birth to my second daughter, so I have been quite busy preparing for this and furthermore I haven’t found any interesting promotions from Bet365 this month.

    I don’t know if they don’t like small affiliates - perhaps just me - or if they are having serious financial problems. But their enforcement of this clause is pushing their terms to the limit of decent behaviour to avoid paying me. This is simply not a kind of behavior I would expect from a reputable program and sponsor of several affiliate communities, and this is what causing me to warn all affiliates, particularly small affiliates.

    They probably also have a silly rule somewhere saying that if an affiliate complain he will have to run naked through the streets and send pictures of it before he can get paid, but if this huge company really want to bully their small affiliates, I hope the affiliate communities can help the small affiliates to fight back.
    Last edited by Arjun; 01-18-2013 at 01:12 PM. Reason: Removed Personal name
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  3. #2
    Moderator - Big Kahuna Dominique's Avatar
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    These T&Cs are nuts. I am removing them.
    dominique




    A successful man is one who can lay a firm foundation with the bricks others have thrown at him.
    David Brinkley
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    Those T and C's have been there a long long time .That is why I never pushed them for the Poker
    Post an article in http://www.gamblingshares.com/ The up and coming Premier Gambling Article Directory
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  7. #4
    CAP Listed Program - bet365 James_W's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pjotter View Post
    I thought Bet365 was a reputable program, but after what I have learned today I would suggest people to look for other programs if they can avoid Bet365.

    In my opinion they do not offer anything special, and from what I have learned they will only go that extra mile when it comes to withholding your rightfully owed commissions.

    Some big affiliates will probably disagree, but I hope everyone can see this from a small affiliate’s point of view - and that this is not ok.

    Well, he is my story:

    I am owed a mere commission amount of just $120 as of December 2012 and I have finally honored their affiliate-unfriendly minimum quota of five players, also in December 2012. So having honored this quota, I was thinking this month, January 2013, I was finally going to get paid for my efforts to promote them.

    Apart from the minimum quota, they also have a cumbersome requirement for payment where you have to generate invoices, print these, sign them and fax/email these to get paid. So I sent the invoice 08 January 2013. Nothing happens until 10 days later, today, where XXXX, my sudden affiliate manager from Bet365, contacts me via email. I don’t recall having ever received a personal email or a call from them, even though I have probably been affiliated with them for more than 5 years (It a good thing for them that they don’t have a minimum affiliate manager activity quota). After telling me that he is now my dedicated affiliate manager, this message follows:

    "As part of the programmes terms and conditions, we do require that an affiliate is actively promoting us in order to be able to withdraw their funds.

    I can’t seem to find where bet365 are being promoted on your site Casino Bonus News.

    Could you please provide me with a link to where you are promoting us?"

    I can’t believe what I am reading, but I do check the terms to find this:

    "6. Continued Promotion
    You shall incorporate and prominently and continually display the most up-to-date links provided by us on all pages of your website in a manner and location agreed by us and you shall not alter the form, location or operation of the links without our prior written consent. You are eligible for Referral Commissions based upon your continued promotion of Sports at bet365, Casino at bet365, Poker at bet365, Games at bet365 or Bingo at bet365. We reserve the right to reduce Referral Commission percentages if you reduce your efforts to recruit new Customers. Your reduced or suspended promotion of our sites will be deemed to represent your termination of this Agreement."

    I guess this is the clause he refers to as new reason for refusing payment, but I haven't received a reply yet to my question: are you serious?!

    I have links on Casino Bonus News to Bet365 as I have on other of my web sites. Last month I generated 42 click-throughs, 2 new players and 1 depositing player. Fair enough, so this month I only generated 4 click-troughs according to their stats, but my wife is just about to give birth to my second daughter, so I have been quite busy preparing for this and furthermore I haven’t found any interesting promotions from Bet365 this month.

    I don’t know if they don’t like small affiliates - perhaps just me - or if they are having serious financial problems. But their enforcement of this clause is pushing their terms to the limit of decent behaviour to avoid paying me. This is simply not a kind of behavior I would expect from a reputable program and sponsor of several affiliate communities, and this is what causing me to warn all affiliates, particularly small affiliates.

    They probably also have a silly rule somewhere saying that if an affiliate complain he will have to run naked through the streets and send pictures of it before he can get paid, but if this huge company really want to bully their small affiliates, I hope the affiliate communities can help the small affiliates to fight back.
    Pjotter,

    It would be best if I called you next week to discuss your concerns, please let me know when you are free and I will ensure I am available to speak over the phone. I am not really keen on discussing individual affiliate accounts on public threads. I have your contact details here from your affiliate account.

    It is important to clarify that we sent this payment prior to this post, please could you kindly check. Also, and not really an issue as your opinion on this may differ, which is fair enough, but I do feel it slightly unfair to name your new affiliate manager on a public thread based on a single, non-inflammatory email, asking for clarity on promotion, which ultimately was to ensure we can process the payment and satisfy the finance department. The reason I say this is this request could have come from anyone in my team so the situation is really between yourself and the business as opposed to individuals, I hope that sounds fair.

    Speak to you next week and hopefully can satisfy your concerns then.

    Have a nice weekend.

    James
    Last edited by Arjun; 01-18-2013 at 01:12 PM. Reason: Removed Personal Name
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  8. #5
    Senior Member pjotter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James_W View Post
    Pjotter,

    It would be best if I called you next week to discuss your concerns, please let me know when you are free and I will ensure I am available to speak over the phone. I am not really keen on discussing individual affiliate accounts on public threads. I have your contact details here from your affiliate account.

    It is important to clarify that we sent this payment prior to this post, please could you kindly check. Also, and not really an issue as your opinion on this may differ, which is fair enough, but I do feel it slightly unfair to name your new affiliate manager on a public thread based on a single, non-inflammatory email, asking for clarity on promotion, which ultimately was to ensure we can process the payment and satisfy the finance department. The reason I say this is this request could have come from anyone in my team so the situation is really between yourself and the business as opposed to individuals, I hope that sounds fair.

    Speak to you next week and hopefully can satisfy your concerns then.

    Have a nice weekend.

    James
    Dear James,

    Thanks for your reply. I have received payment now, many thanks!

    I was also expecting to get paid, but I was very upset at yet another hurdle when I received the email with the subject "Issue with your Payment" and some of the above-mentioned content. I have been a loyal affiliate as well as player at Bet365 so even though I tried to summarize in the above as objective and unbiased as possible it was difficult.

    I apologize for mentioning the affiliate manager by name, I didn't know this was problem. It has nothing to do with this particular affiliate manager, but Bet365 in general. I will remove the name right away, which you can do in the quote as well.

    Nice weekend to you too!

    Thanks,

    Peter
    Last edited by pjotter; 01-18-2013 at 01:41 PM.
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  9. #6
    Member mrdeposit's Avatar
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    I am not trying to bump this thread. I just want to voice my opinion. First off, I love Bet365. They convert so well but after selling my last affiliate account. I will not be promoting them again because I don't want to go through the process of "generate invoices, print them, sign them, and fax/email them" just to get paid. I should only have to enter my payment details one time and that's during signup. After that, I expect to be paid for my hard work without the B.S.

    Anyway, until that is changed I will send my traffic else where even though I know Bet365 would convert better
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  10. #7
    Senior Beer Member TheGooner's Avatar
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    crazy1

    Just to provide balance to this thread ...

    Bet365 are probably the BEST European facing program for players, offering sports, casino and poker player and certainly Bet365 are one of the top five European programs for serious for igaming affiliates.

    They do have their foibles, such as 5 player minimum quota, and a unique invoicing system, but these are minor quibbles - and they are a rock solid operation that's been around since 1974!!

    Do your research.

    Oh - and if any affiliates REALLY are planning on dropping the Bet365 program on the strength of this thread - feel free to link your old content page to our Bet365 Review instead .

    I'll be happy to deal with the "hassle" of 5 player quota, and generating a monthly invoice ...
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  12. #8
    Senior Member pjotter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGooner View Post
    Just to provide balance to this thread ...

    Bet365 are probably the BEST European facing program for players, offering sports, casino and poker player and certainly Bet365 are one of the top five European programs for serious for igaming affiliates.

    They do have their foibles, such as 5 player minimum quota, and a unique invoicing system, but these are minor quibbles - and they are a rock solid operation that's been around since 1974!!

    Do your research.

    Oh - and if any affiliates REALLY are planning on dropping the Bet365 program on the strength of this thread - feel free to link your old content page to our Bet365 Review instead .

    I'll be happy to deal with the "hassle" of 5 player quota, and generating a monthly invoice ...
    Thanks for your 2 cents. They are probably a great affiliate program to you, and it was affiliates like you I was thinking of when I wrote that big affiliates probably do well with this program. I wouldn’t mind generating the monthly invoice if I was waiting for a six figured commission either

    I really don’t want to start a debate with you, but from a general point of view I think all affiliates shouldn’t take easy on affiliate unfriendly terms like these, no matter how well the program performs for them. While you can laugh at 5 minimum players quotas as a "minor quibble" etc., please remember that my concerns were primarily their extreme enforcement of this clause:

    "6. Continued Promotion
    You shall incorporate and prominently and continually display the most up-to-date links provided by us on all pages of your website in a manner and location agreed by us and you shall not alter the form, location or operation of the links without our prior written consent. You are eligible for Referral Commissions based upon your continued promotion of Sports at bet365, Casino at bet365, Poker at bet365, Games at bet365 or Bingo at bet365. We reserve the right to reduce Referral Commission percentages if you reduce your efforts to recruit new Customers. Your reduced or suspended promotion of our sites will be deemed to represent your termination of this Agreement."

    Less than a month after having achieved the 5 players (which is NOT a minor quibble to me), they were withholding my payment and sending my an email with "Issue with your payment". Many things can happen, also to big affiliates like you, so my warning is valid to all affiliates. I guess you wouldn’t see it as a minor quibble if they chose to withhould your payment, because you ”… reduced your efforts to recruit new customers …” - if something happened to you.

    I would like to stress that I have been paid after having complained! But my experience simply shows that Bet365 will withhold a payment only days after not producing enough clicks. Many programs probably and unfortunately have similar clauses, but I have NEVER experienced such extreme enforcement (and again they did choose to pay me after I complained, but why is this necessary, and will the finance department allow them to do so next time??)!

    BTW, I don’t understand the ”do your research” comment, but it seems somewhat arrogant to the problem I experienced. How should doing my research have helped me in this situation?
    Last edited by pjotter; 01-19-2013 at 03:29 AM.
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  13. #9
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    For affiliates that do not have tons of sports bettng traffic bet365 is not the best program because of their negative carry over policy (including bundling revenues of all products).

    I am hoping to get out the negatives this year.............
    Guide to Online Casino Canada for bonuses and reviews.
    Ranking the best online casino sites.
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    They are one of the best affiliate program, but from my experience you will have to send them a lot of players to stay in positive. Maybe to try with ComeOn (starts with 25% rev share, no NCO, no admin fees, certified by AGD, clean terms).
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