Ron Paul?

Professor · #1 07-02-2008, 15:33:35

Ok I know many affiliates have indicated they would love to vote for Ron Paul for the Republican nomination and in the general elections this fall.

Obviously he does have some traction on the internet and college campuses, but unfortunately Presidents are NOT elected by popular vote in the United States. They are instead elected by DELEGATE VOTE. I believe the original intent of this system was that delegates would vote based on the choices of the constituents they represent. Well that isnt what happens in reality. A good case in point was when Ross Perot ran a very successful campaign as an independant and despite receiving 30% of the popular vote he didnt receive ANY delegate votes.

During the past few weeks the Republican primaries have been held across the US and the delegates are being awarded to McCain, Romney and Huckabee. Even though he has had to have SOME votes in all those primaries Ron Paul hasnt received a single delegate when I checked last. So its mathematically impossible for him to be elected even if 99% of the popular vote was for him.

Knowing that voting for him rather then a candidate who has a chance in getting elected acheives nothing and that no real message is sent to anyone its just a wasted vote why arent more people who really want a change in government looking at Obama or Hillary?

At least it wouldnt be a wasted vote and the new government isn't going to continue to hammer away on our freedoms, our economy, our military and our good will around the world as the Republicans have over the last eight years.

I think its time we chose the lesser of two evils and got behind a party that has a chance of election and that will reverse the damages done by Bush and Company.

My two cents what are your thoughts?

Focal · #2 07-02-2008, 16:14:35

I don't think any vote is a wasted vote if done with honesty and integrity. If you think Ron Paul should be President, than you should vote for Ron Paul whether he as 1,000 delegates or 0. If more people would vote for the candidate they truly felt should be president rather than look at it as wasting a vote, I think other people would step up and vote for their chosen candidate.

For instance, in the last election, democrats gave hell to supporters of the green party saying they were wasting their vote by voting for Ralph Nader. I don't agree. If you are really truly a supporter of Ralph Nader, than you are not wasting your vote.

Mark

Professor · #3 07-02-2008, 16:42:03

Fair enough and I agree in principal BUT the fact remains that 10,000,000 votes for Ron Paul/ Ralph Nader/ Ross Perot/ Hulk Hogan wouldnt cause any of them to be elected.

Yes it will make you or I feel warm and fuzzy as we leave the polling booth but after that nothing happens. Delegates decide elections in the US and its clear they positively will not cast their vote for an independant or past independant no matter what you or I vote.

They will vote by party though and thats where our power lies. Votes for candidates that are represented by the electoral college do make a difference.

If this wasnt such a critical time for our country I would say "yeah vote your conscience only, hell write in Me or Dominique if you so choose" but we REALLY need a change NOW.

Our industry, our economy, our military, our middle class cant take another four to eight years of this abuse. Thats why I suggested we marshall our votes where we can effect a positive change for our country and the world. Its too important to fail this time.

Renee · #4 07-02-2008, 20:02:47

Hey Prof

I don't know much about US politics other than what i read here, but isn't it true that it is NOT compulsory to vote in the US?

If this is the case, if less than half the population (or less than the required amount) do not vote, that would mean they would have to do elections all over again right?
A friend was telling me here after our election that it would be better that it wasn't compulsory to vote, because if people didn't like the candidates, and then didn't vote, if enough people don't vote, and continued not to vote, they would have to change the candidates if they wanted order..

To me, that sounds more logical than voting for someone just because they are there..

I mean if more than half the country decided they didn't want any of the candidates, they would have to keep changing until someone liked was up right...

I know it probably wouldn't happen.. but just a thought..
It's compulsory to vote here.. If you don't, you get fined. The problem with our country is that people don't research before they vote.. then you get someone like Kevin Rudd as the prime minister... Sheesh!

Good luck

Professor · #5 07-02-2008, 20:22:56

Nope Renee unfortunately thats not true in the US. Even if only 20% of the popluation vote the electoral college will cast their votes and a new president is elected (or retained). We have a very odd system of democracy here.

In the last few elections the Republicans staged telephone campaigns to voters in lower economic areas and told them that the voting dates had changed or that they were to report to a different polling place. They did this knowing that the majority of their power base lies with upper middle class and wealthy voters. So here was an example where a party went out of its way to lower overall votes to steal an election. They use every dirty trick in the book here.

Renee · #6 07-02-2008, 20:32:56

Wow that makes me sick...
I really hate politicians. Better left at the bottom of a large body of water in my opinion....

Well good luck either way.. I hope it turns out for the better (even if the better is still bad :P)

Dominique · #7 07-02-2008, 21:33:49

This is what Obama's church has as guidelines:

Cita:

Below are the church's 12-precepts and covenantal statements called the "Black Value System."

Commitment to God
Commitment to the Black Community
Commitment to the Black Family
Dedication to the Pursuit of Education
Dedication to the Pursuit of Excellence
Adherence to the Black Work Ethic
Commitment to Self-Discipline and Self-Respect
Disavowal of the Pursuit of "Middleclassness"
Pledge to make the fruits of all developing and acquired skills available to the Black Community
Pledge to Allocate Regularly, a Portion of Personal Resources for Strengthening and Supporting Black Institutions
Pledge allegiance to all Black leadership who espouse and embrace the Black Value System
Personal commitment to embracement of the Black Value System.

Disavowal of the Pursuit of "Middleclassness"

Just what does that part mean?

wallstreeterww · #8 07-02-2008, 22:15:23

Who the heck gets to decide who becomes a delegate because it seems like the delegates dont represent the will of the american people or the truth . Without a doubt Ron Pauls truely represents the majority will of the common man and really has the best plan to revitalize our economy, the democrats certainly dont and the other republican candidates certainly dont. I think we really have to raise awareness of the way our presidents get elected.

Every other candidate but ron paul is in the backpocket of a big institution, every single one of them. How can any of them except for ron paul really care about us?

slotplayer · #9 07-02-2008, 23:47:57

Cita:

Empezado por wallstreeterww

Who the heck gets to decide who becomes a delegate because it seems like the delegates dont represent the will of the american people or the truth . Without a doubt Ron Pauls truely represents the majority will of the common man and really has the best plan to revitalize our economy, the democrats certainly dont and the other republican candidates certainly dont. I think we really have to raise awareness of the way our presidents get elected.

Every other candidate but ron paul is in the backpocket of a big institution, every single one of them. How can any of them except for ron paul really care about us?

Unfortunately Ron Paul was talking over most peoples' heads when it came to the economy. His message was erattic and he came off sounding like a quack with the limited air time he received. Plus in one debate he couldn't remember it was the Kurds in Northern Iraq and ended up saying something like "the people up north". That didn't help.

Professor · #10 08-02-2008, 10:00:21

Dom I have no idea what that particular statement means, but Obama and Democrats in general are clearly far more dedicated to the middle class then Republicans.

Excellent obervation Wallstreet. Most American's dont have a clue about how our election system really works. They think each vote "counts" and that the will of the people determine winners in Presidential campaigns.

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